View Full Version : DNI - Documento Nacionál de Identidad
On DNI -
I could totally be wrong and it's not worth me calling my local lawyer here again to check but from what I was told and understand a) yes, you can get legal residency to live here permanently without tourist visa, without getting a DNI. So I understand that residency and DNI are separate things.
But b) you can not get a DNI without establishing residency, so when someone says I went through and got my DNI, it means they are also a legal permanent resident. (there is a separate foreign corporate or business tax ID that you can apply for without establishing any personal residency but that's a whole separate topic and aside from this discussion)
And c) my reference to DNI was in the context that as far as living here full time and owning property - you did not need a DNI. (living here full time in the sense whether you are an actual legal permanent resident or just permanent as in this is your home of operations but you still have to do the Colonia run)
When I first consulted my USA based international properties lawyer (my company has purchased property assets in various countries abroad so I keep one on retainer at a local LA firm) he initially advised me that in order to purchase property here in Argentina, I either should or would need to get a DNI either personally or in the equivalent of the USA TID for corporations or business entities. Now this might be because I was going to and did purchase my property as a classified business asset as far as US tax paying regulations go. But either way, when I then had that checked with a local Argentine firm, they provided a means for me to buy and classify my property as either personal or business asset as far as the US was concerned, and still legally own the property here without a DNI.
Long and boring, so my short version was - living here (in whatever sense) and buying property, does not need a DNI. End of story.
Long and boring, so my short version was - living here (in whatever sense) and buying property, does not need a DNI. End of story.When you apply for permanent residence, you get a visa stamp in your passport and you also get a DNI. That is the way it works. For property purchase you need a CUIT or taxation number. This is seperate from the DNI. Argentinians and permanent residents need their DNI and foreigners need their passport when applying for a CUIT. And you need the CUIT to buy a property. End of story.
Sidney Riley
01-17-08, 22:55
Long and boring, so my short version was - living here (in whatever sense) and buying property, does not need a DNI. End of story.Not referring to a DNI per se, but related.
From what I am seeing around town lately, the lack of permanent residency might come back to haunt you when you go to sell the property. From what I am seeing, people without permanent residency have a much more difficult time selling than those who bothered to get it. This is all anecdotal, and in the end I could be entirely wrong. But the several expats I know who have recently sold or are tying to sell their properties fall into two clearly delineated categories: those with permanent residence, who find selling relatively easy, and those without, who are having a royal pain in the ass selling.
If you've gone to the trouble of getting on the permanent residency track, it strikes me as somewhat ridiculous not to go ahead and get your DNI. Not that you need it, but at that point, why not?
I'm no expert, but my experience from buying, selling, and then buying a second property in Argentina, showed me.
1 You need a CUIT.
2 You don't need a DNI.
3 Buying is straightforward, but to sell, my only problem was that I needed proof of a divorce. i.e.. From the UK the original divorce document had to be approved by the Foreign Office and then translated by an official translator here in Argentina.
More or less.
Good report and another reason to get a DNI is that it's easy to have Argentina as a refugee if things go wrong in your country (civil war, etc)
I was wondering if an Argentine buys clothes she can pass me the receipts and I can claim the tax-free refund with my EU pasport?
And does this work if you are Argentinian with an European pasport?
Good report and another reason to get a DNI is that it's easy to have Argentina as a refugee if things go wrong in your country (civil war, etc)Greetings everyone,
I know that this is "The Critic-Free Zone", but there's an exception for Redondo because he is what's known as a "Reoccurring Idiot".
Redondo, you ignorant ****: As has already been discussed several times in this forum, a DNI and a residency have no connection with each other. A DNI is a tax ID number, and a residency is the permission to live in the country. Thus, in the event that "things go wrong in your country", one would need a residency to live here in Argentina, not a DNI.
Thanks,
Jackson
If you've gone to the trouble of getting on the permanent residency track, it strikes me as somewhat ridiculous not to go ahead and get your DNI. Not that you need it, but at that point, why not?I've asked this question a number of times in person and on this forum, and I have yet to get an answer, but here it is again:
Why would anyone voluntarily obtain a Tax ID number by registering themselves with the Argentina tax authorities, thus deliberately placing themselves under the auspices of said tax authorities, all to have a tax ID number that they do not need?
This is not a rhetorical question, I really want to know. Is there some advantage that I'm unaware of? I know you don't need a DNI to open a bank account, buy health insurance, or buy a car, or to buy property, so it's not for those reasons. Does having a DNI (instead of a CUIT) make it easier to buy and sell property here in Argentina?
Thanks,
Jackson
AFAIK your DNI and CUIT are (almost) the same number, meaning that if there is a difference, it is only in the first bit.
You need a CUIT to buy the property, otherwise the escritura can not be completed, leaving you with only a very expensive piece of paper, but without the property.
The moment you have a DNI, you automatically have a CUIT.
Please correct me if I am wrong. (Aqualung?)
Seaman
"Reoccurring Idiot".
I like that phrase, not quite as good as ""CockSucker" but it gets the point across.
Exon
I've asked this question a number of times in person and on this forum, and I have yet to get an answer, but here it is again:
Why would anyone voluntarily obtain a Tax ID number by registering themselves with the Argentina tax authorities, thus deliberately placing themselves under the auspices of said tax authorities, all to have a tax ID number that they do not need?
This is not a rhetorical question, I really want to know. Is there some advantage that I'm unaware of? I know you don't need a DNI to open a bank account, buy health insurance, or buy a car, or to buy property, so it's not for those reasons. Does having a DNI (instead of a CUIT) make it easier to buy and sell property here in Argentina?
Thanks,
JacksonThe DNI is an identification document. Compulsory for all Argentinos and all permanent residents.
The CUIT is your tax file number and if you are not in receipt of monies earned in Argentina, there is no tax or reports to be made or paid. In my case since I do not receive income here, I have never made a report or been requested to make a report. So it is not a hassle. But the CUIT is the document you need to buy a property and to sell it.
To answer your question Jackson, the DNI makes no difference in the buying and selling of property but does have great advantages in travel. No need for visas for the other attached countries to Argentina. Just the DNI. No passport either required and it sure as hell is much more convenient in size than a passport. Especially for the million and one times your ID is demanded. And there is no need ever to do a visa run again. I have had mine for 17 years and it never goes out of date.
Suerte.
Argento
First, the confusion of DNI vs. CUIT.
The DNI is the "Documento Nacionál de Identidad". It IS not a number, it HAS one, and it is the identity document every Argentine citizen has to bear, and which, among other things, enables him to travel to adjacent countries, but also identifies him in all kinds of official and private business. This type of document is known in a lot of countries (including my own) to me the anglo - saxon part of the world seems to be the exception of this habit.
And, apart from Argentine nationals, it is also issued to foreigners with a legal residential status. Compare it to a green card.
Second, good life costs money. And for most people, the reason of getting up in the morning and engage in some sort of commercial activity is to earn that money they need / want to have a decent to good life, today and during the days after they retire from said activities. And that women are part of a good life is, as I assume, general consensus on this board. And the traditional way, and fortunately latin societies are quite traditional, is that the gentleman pays the bill.
I understand both the points of Thomaso, whom I consider a personal friend, and from whom I know that he earned his money the hard way, as well as tha one of Mpexy. I also invited a lady I met through the "hobby" to my country, and I was rewarded by some of the most unforgettable days of my life. And that's not only sex. That's the joy in the eyes of somebody who has never seen snow in her life when driving through wintery mountains. And throwing snowballs. And that is something a million bucks can't buy.
I have never been overly attracted by "model types". That has to do with that I don't feel too comfortable in the glamorous world, and with the fact that I very well know a professional photographer wo describes models as the most stupid species on the planet. It is all a question of personal abilities and preferences.
Just 2 centavos de.
El Alemán
Argento,
We have written the same thing at the same time - you just were a bit faster!
Greetings everyone,
I know that this is "The Critic-Free Zone", but there's an exception for Redondo because he is what's known as a "Reoccurring Idiot".
Redondo, you ignorant ****: As has already been discussed several times in this forum, a DNI and a residency have no connection with each other. A DNI is a tax ID number, and a residency is the permission to live in the country. Thus, in the event that "things go wrong in your country", one would need a residency to live here in Argentina, not a DNI.
Thanks,
JacksonIf you have a DNI you are a citizen of Argentina and you must be allowed in to the country.
Did your parents teach you to insult?
If you have a DNI you are a citizen of Argentina and you must be allowed in to the country.
Did your parents teach you to insult?Redondo, you ignorant ****.
Wrong again. Citizens of other countries who have an Argentine residency can obtain a DNI, and of course the aformentioned group are not Argentine citizens.
And no, I learned to insult idiots all by myself. It's a natural response to my inability to easily suffer fools.
Thanks,
Jackson
Redondo.
A DNI doesn't automatically make you a citizen. It does mean you are at least a legal resident. If you think it is very important for you to get one, then by all means do so. There are some (myself included) that don't believe it is an integral part of living and functioning in Argentina. That is all.
BM.
If you have a DNI you are a citizen of Argentina and you must be allowed in to the country.
Redondo.
A DNI doesn't automatically make you a citizen. It does mean you are at least a legal resident. If you think it is very important for you to get one, then by all means do so. There are some (myself included) that don't believe it is an integral part of living and functioning in Argentina. That is all.
BM.My initial point was that you always have to be allowed into a Argentina with a DNI this is correct.
You can live 20 years abroad, but your DNI will always be valid.
This could be a reason for some people to apply for a DNI
I highly doubt this.
You can live 20 years abroad, but your DNI will always be valid.
I highly doubt this.Ask Argento.
I have lived more then 6 months a year in Argentina for the last 3 years and have no reason / need for a DNI
Rock Harders
01-19-08, 19:09
Mongers-
Every single one of you is a least a bit confused about the purpose and differences between a DNI, CUIL, CUIT, and CDI. Once a person has legal residency (other than a student or temporary retiree visa) he may obtain a personal CUIL, which is a PERSONAL taxpayer identification number. On my paystubs from my job in Argentina, my CUIL is posted. On the other hand, a CUIT is the tax indentification number of a business or corporation. A CDI is a seperate tax identification number, different than both a CUIL or CUIT, which is required for foreigners to buy property. A DNI is the primary personal identification document that Argentine residents need to conduct all their official business including travel between Mercosur member states. A green DNI is that of an Argentine CITIZEN, whereas a red DNI is that of a RESIDENT FOREIGNER. Another misnomer is that once a RESIDENT FOREIGNER has obtained his DNI, he may travel to neighboring countries that would otherwise require a visa of his nationality visa free- this is completely false. Your nationality is clearly displayed in your RESIDENT FOREIGNER DNI and you will not be permitted to pass without the necessary visas (Brasil, Paraguay)
Suerte,
Dirk Diggler
If you have a red DNI are you considered a resident, can you return whenever you please, and is it valid for the rest of your life?
ComeOnDown
01-19-08, 21:33
Not to add to the confusion, I just want to share a personal experience with regards to financial transactions. I was able to buy a car as well as open a peso bank account with Banco Galicia by merely presenting my passport and my CDI. I was able to secure my CDI in a day.
Sidney Riley
01-20-08, 05:16
Why would anyone voluntarily obtain a Tax ID number by registering themselves with the Argentina tax authorities, thus deliberately placing themselves under the auspices of said tax authorities, all to have a tax ID number that they do not need?I don't think it's a tax ID number.
This is not a rhetorical question, I really want to know. Is there some advantage that I'm unaware of? I know you don't need a DNI to open a bank account, buy health insurance, or buy a car, or to buy property, so it's not for those reasons. Does having a DNI (instead of a CUIT) make it easier to buy and sell property here in Argentina? At the material level, I needed it to change my ABL Rentas to my name. I think the Argentine bureaucrats may have been asleep at the wheel that day, but they wanted it nonetheless.
Regarding bank accounts, it seems to depend on the bank. Some banks told me that not only did I need a DNI, but I also needed three months of utility bills to open an account. Eventually I opted not to get a bank account since I really don't need one, and having one definitely exposes you to the tax people.
That aside, having a DNI has made my life marginally easier. When you walk around town, it's good to have some form of official ID. I don't like carrying my passport, so I carry a DNI. I've had to use it (in lieu of a passport) on more than one occasion to get into such things as the national library, certain museums, etc. Also, on one or two occasions the police have asked me for ID, and I used it. In general, it seems to generate a bit more seriousness on the part of Argentines when you show them a DNI instead of a passport. At least that's my impression.
I never, repeat never, walk around with my passport. Never have had a problem with that.
You can also carry a fotocopy, that would do the trick as well.
I know that once you get a DNI then Argentina can tax your worldwide income, pero, don't you need a DNI if you want to gain permanent residency?
Suerte.
Stowe
Daddy Rulz
01-21-08, 03:08
A CUIT is something you thrust into and out of with your johnson, except for that sick fuck STOWE he prefers BUIT.
The DNI which stands for Don't Need Intercourse from fat, ugly American bitches anymore, (the last 6 letters where removed by the paperwork reduction act of 1963 DNIFFUAB was found to be unwieldy) is neither for residence nor identification. It's simply a vehicle whereby the bored workers of La Republica de la Argentina, can tell you that the paperwork they just insisted you have hand delivered from the Untied States and stamped as authentic by their Tia Maria, at an exorbitant FEO (for extranjeros only) price incidentally, is in fact not the paperwork they needed after all. What they need is something entirely unrelated but it will be time consuming and expensive to get, requiring no less than 3 more stamps from Tia Maria.
Once secured though a DNI (FFUAB) and I'm sorry to disagree with you Dirk, red ones are for known pedophiles not extranjeros, funny you're usually so accurate with your posts, does have it's uses. It gets you discounts on CUIT at Madahos because with it you enjoy all of the birthrights of natural born Argentines. Including but not limited to, a lack of logic in all things economic, the right to enjoy cheap beef and wine, subsidized electricity, the inability to have a conversation on a cell phone without waving your hands around in the air as if the person you are talking to can actually see you. And of course access to the lower tier of the two tiered pricing structure that exists for everything except beer at the Disco and smokes at the kiosko, airplane tickets with Aerolinias as well as CUIT at Madahos. Additionally you get to share in the wonderful pun that is this cities name, though you don't actually need a DNI (FFUAB) for that as it's available to residents and tourists alike.
A CUIL is something you use to write with when the kiosko is out of piseras, it is also something a porcupine sticks in your ass cheek if you sit on it. Only that sick fuck STOWE looks for porcupines to sit on. How they got involved in this discussion can only be attributed to bad moderation on Jacksons part.
A CDI is an old form of Argentinian birth control endorsed by the Vatican, it stands for "Condom Distractus Interuptus." Essentially how it works is thus: you're getting a BBBJ from some hot provider, you fully intend to put a cap on your jimmy before entering the holy of holies. However; in the heat of the moment you don't, and just jam it in. You're intending to either pull it out at a later moment to put a cap on it before the finish or simply to pull it out and finish all over her face and tits but you don't and instead spew inside. You then worry for a few months if you're going to have to flee the country or start a new round of support payments all the while examining your Jimmy constantly for any signs of some incurable STD (Seriously Tornup Dick). None of this applies to STOWE or Flexible HORN of course. STOWE because that sick fuck is sticking it up their poop shoots (though he does have the examination phase) and Flexible HORN because that pathetic excuse he calls a penis (I've seen it only due to photos on the web site you fucking degenerates) simply cannot achieve penetration.
If you don't believe me you can check it out on the dickopedia.
Hope this helps.
DR
If you have a red DNI are you considered a resident, can you return whenever you please, and is it valid for the rest of your life?Greetings everyone,
In anticipation of Redondo's next question:
"I heard that you can use a DNI for discounts at Disney World. Does anybody know if this is true?"
Thanks,
Jackson
I know that once you get a DNI then Argentina can tax your worldwide income, pero, don't you need a DNI if you want to gain permanent residency?
Suerte.
StoweHi Stowe,
This is the $64,000 question.
I received my residency (along with a number of other forum members) through the "fast track" program that was offered for a short time approximately 3 years ago. Technically, under this program, my residency is "temporary" in that it needs to renewed every 2 years until the 2nd renewal, at which time it converts into a permanent residency.
FYI, my attorney has advised me that although my residency is temporary, it carries all the rights of, and is virtually indistinguishable from, a permanent residency.
Anyway, when I received my temporary residency I was handed a slip of paper with the address of the office to apply for a DNI, which I did not pursue. When I renewed my temporary residency last year, they made no mention of my DNI or lack thereof.
So here's my question for the group:
Does anybody know from personal experience if a DNI is or will be required when my now temporary residency is up for renewal and simultaneous conversion to a permanent residency?
Also, for anybody who has gone through the standard process for obtaining a residency: Were you required to obtain a DNI as part of the process?
Thanks,
Jackson
Sidney Riley
01-21-08, 17:53
Does anybody know from personal experience if a DNI is or will be required when my now temporary residency is up for renewal.When I renewed my temporary residency, there were no questions about whether or not I had a DNI. I only took in my passport and residency paperwork and photocopies of everything. I didn't offer the DNI, and they didn't ask to see it. But then again, I have no idea what they saw when they looked into the computer.
Also, for anybody who has gone through the standard process for obtaining a residency: Were you required to obtain a DNI as part of the process?I went through the standard process, and no one ever told me (either in the U. S. Or here) that I must get a DNI. But again, since I have no idea what they looked for in the computer when I renewed my residency visa, I have no idea whether or not it was necessary.
Regarding taxation of worldwide income, I would be surprised if having a DNI was germane. Being a resident would seem to be the logical thing that would make your income eligible for taxation. As someone else noted, a DNI is simply an identification document with a number and some other personal information. Since you would not be using your DNI outside of Argentina for much of anything (let alone garnering income in, say, Singapore) it would seem to me to have little bearing on the issue. On the other hand, no matter how many people I ask, I can't seem to get a straight answer, either, on the subject of taxation of worldwide income.
Also, for anybody who has gone through the standard process for obtaining a residency: Were you required to obtain a DNI as part of the process?
Thanks,
JacksonIt seems if we are talking about apples and comparing them with pears.
When I applied 17 years ago, a Permanent Resident Visa was stamped in your current passport outside of Argentina, and you applied for your DNI in Argentina. My lawyer at the time gave me no other option. Common sense really. When your passport expires, the Permanent Residency stamp goes phutt as well. Hence you need to get your DNI, which is like herpes, you have it for ever. These 2 year visas are obviously similiar but are not the same. Nashi pears really-looks like an apple, tastes like an apple but is a pear. Almost but not quite.
Following on the CUIT comments. I must apologise. I confused the Clave de Identification (financial ID) which has the same number as your DNI plus one other number, with a CUIT.
I do use my DNI for travel to other Mercosur countries and apart from Chile, have not needed any other document.
Greetings everyone,
In anticipation of Redondo's next question:
"I heard that you can use a DNI for discounts at Disney World. Does anybody know if this is true?"
Thanks,
Jackson
It seems if we are talking about apples and comparing them with pears.Argento knows what he is talking about
When you get a permanent residency (or one of those two year renewable ones) a ledger is automatically opened for you at the Registro Nacional de las Personas and at the Federal Police. The DNI is just a physical proof you carry with you that indicates you have this ledger and therefore a permanent residency.
This ledger is where all your information is stored. Tax, criminal, voting, etc etc etc so not having a DNI so as not to leave a trail for the taxman to follow is stupid. You already have the ledger and as Seaman mentioned your CUIL number is almost the same as you DNI number and that comes from the ledger!
The DNI is not obligatory for most things but it makes life a hell of a lot easier. For example, you can get a car insurance without it but try and get your money if something happens to you if you don't have one. Most insurance companies will fuck around with you for months till you provide one. It is also a proof of residency as it has your address in it. Driving licences are given out by the municipalities and you need proof of residency in any given municipality to apply for the licence.
These are just very few reasons off the top of my head that having a DNI will make your life easier. And that having one is going to make you vulnerable to the taxman is at the least a serious misinformation!
When you get a permanent residency (or one of those two year renewable ones) a ledger is automatically opened for you at the Registro Nacional de las Personas and at the Federal Police. The DNI is just a physical proof you carry with you that indicates you have this ledger and therefore a permanent residency.
This ledger is where all your information is stored. Tax, criminal, voting, etc etc etc so not having a DNI so as not to leave a trail for the taxman to follow is stupid. You already have the ledger and as Seaman mentioned your CUIL number is almost the same as you DNI number and that comes from the ledger!
The DNI is not obligatory for most things but it makes life a hell of a lot easier. For example, you can get a car insurance without it but try and get your money if something happens to you if you don't have one. Most insurance companies will fuck around with you for months till you provide one. It is also a proof of residency as it has your address in it. Driving licences are given out by the municipalities and you need proof of residency in any given municipality to apply for the licence.
These are just very few reasons off the top of my head that having a DNI will make your life easier. And that having one is going to make you vulnerable to the taxman is at the least a serious misinformation!I have been living in Argentina for about 8 months a year for the past 3 years and I never felt the need for an DNI.
I refuge to pay gringo prices and prefer to go by bus or fly abroad instead of paying gringo prices for domestic flights.
I travel 2, 3 times a year to Europe, so mainly I don't need to make a Uruguay trip for visa purposes. I paid 50 peso only one time for overstaying my visa, that was the only time I stayed more then 3 months.
I don't have a property, a car or insurance in Argentina, don't have income in Argentina and don't pay my taxes in Argentina.
As long as this does not change I don't plan to apply for a DNI or a ressidency. If I want one of the above I probally would.
I have been living in Argentina for about 8 months a year for the past 3 years and I never felt the need for an DNI.
I refuge to pay gringo prices and prefer to go by bus or fly abroad instead of paying gringo prices for domestic flights.
I travel 2, 3 times a year to Europe, so mainly I don't need to make a Uruguay trip for visa purposes. I paid 50 peso only one time for overstaying my visa, that was the only time I stayed more then 3 months.
I don't have a property, a car or insurance in Argentina, don't have income in Argentina and don't pay my taxes in Argentina.
As long as this does not change I don't plan to apply for a DNI or a ressidency. If I want one of the above I probally would.You have all the right in the world not to need a DNI - What I don't understand is why you quote my post before launching into a narrative about your living experience in BA. I posted about what happens IF you take out a residency. What has that to do with your decision not to pay gringo prices (which you wouldn't if you had a DNI)
Redondo, in the future I would appreciate that when you quote me, your posts are relative to what I said. Thank you
Jackson said it best: "Reoccurring Idiot".
Exon
Jackson said it best "Reoccurring Idiot".
ExonAnd "Redundant Redondo".
"Redundant Redondo"
That's got a nice ring to it!
Thanks DB.
Jackson
The DNI is not obligatory for most things but it makes life a hell of a lot easier. For example, you can get a car insurance without it but try and get your money if something happens to you if you don't have one. Most insurance companies will fuck around with you for months till you provide one. It is also a proof of residency as it has your address in it. Driving licences are given out by the municipalities and you need proof of residency in any given municipality to apply for the licence.
These are just very few reasons off the top of my head that having a DNI will make your life easier. And that having one is going to make you vulnerable to the taxman is at the least a serious misinformation!Aqualung, the various reasons you state for having the DNI are all accurate, except for one. One does not need the DNI to get a driving license, all you need is a passport and a current visa stamp. I was able to get my license just using my passport.
Suerte
Daddy Rulz
01-23-08, 12:19
"Redundant Redondo"
That's got a nice ring to it!
Thanks DB.
JacksonI'm not sure as to it's accuracy, but it's pithy, I tell you, pithy.
Redondo,
Congratulations! You just made it to my ignore list! You should feel special now, since you are the FIRST one on that list!
I was wondering if anyone could share information with me regarding where one could get a cdi number? Is this for someone who might be a USA citizen, and wanted to buy property with a porteno? Is that too complicated, meaning owning in in joint owner ship? And could I ever get my funds out of the country on a sale? It seems people in lesser parts of BA purchase property without papers, then apply somewhere and get the papers later to sell. I hear it is quite common. Just wondering how one could purchase propertty there without being a resident?
Also what exactly is a retired visa?
Thank you
I replied in PM.
I was wondering if anyone could share information with me regarding where one could get a cdi number? Is this for someone who might be a USA citizen, and wanted to buy property with a porteno? Is that too complicated, meaning owning in in joint owner ship? And could I ever get my funds out of the country on a sale? It seems people in lesser parts of BA purchase property without papers, then apply somewhere and get the papers later to sell. I hear it is quite common. Just wondering how one could purchase propertty there without being a resident? Also what exactly is a retired visa? Thank you
So here's my question for the group:
Does anybody know from personal experience if a DNI is or will be required when my now temporary residency is up for renewal and simultaneous conversion to a permanent residency?
Also, for anybody who has gone through the standard process for obtaining a residency: Were you required to obtain a DNI as part of the process?
Thanks,
JacksonHi Jackson,
Here is my experience with the DNI.
I moved here 8 months ago on a work visa. When I got my the stamp in my passport, they gave me two envelopes: one for the immigration officer when I arrived in Argentina and the other to take to the DNI office. I was required to deliver the latter within 15 days of the date of my visa.
So, as part of working in Argentina, I was required to get a DNI.
Also, my employer could not open a bank account for me without the DNI. Not sure why since my landlord (who works for a bank) said he could open my account with a copy of my employment contract and my CUIT which I had before the DNI.
Schmoj
I was wondering if anyone could share information with me regarding where one could get a cdi number? Is this for someone who might be a USA citizen, and wanted to buy property with a porteno? Is that too complicated, meaning owning in in joint owner ship? And could I ever get my funds out of the country on a sale? It seems people in lesser parts of BA purchase property without papers, then apply somewhere and get the papers later to sell. I hear it is quite common. Just wondering how one could purchase propertty there without being a resident?
Also what exactly is a retired visa?
Thank youRemember that just 6 years ago the Argentines could only withdraw a limited amount a week and lost about 70% of their savings
It is next to impossible to get a clear answer as to whether a DNI is required or not. I am amazed that after all this time it is still an open question.
Suerte.
Stowe
Rock Harders
03-19-08, 17:16
Mongers-
Obtaining a DNI is absolutely NOT necessary as part of the process of obtaining temporary / permanant residence in Argentina. I have temporary residency, renewable annually, and I have yet to obtain my DNI yet I am able to have a bank account and do all other things someone with a DNI can do because I have my CUIL. The CUIL is obtained at the ANSES building on Cordoba between Cerrito and Libertad and it takes about an hour to get it. The key is the CUIL, which is your personal taxpayer identification number and actually contains your DNI number should you ever apply for the document. The CUIL is 20-xxxxxxxx-x, with the eight digits in the middle being identical to your DNI number.
Suerte,
Dirk Diggler
Great post and spot on.
But, what taxation consequences do you face. My worst fear is getting stopped when I exit Arg. And being asked for tax $. For mongers who do not work here, I would doubt there would be any problems. The problem is you open yourself up to the Arg. Beauracracy, and we DNI pursuers are aware of that morass.
Is it possible they will tax you on your world wide income and Soc. Security.
It worries me they will get too intrusive.
Thoughts.
Jackpot DNI holder.
Daddy Rulz
03-20-08, 18:43
Great post and spot on.
But, what taxation consequences do you face. My worst fear is getting stopped when I exit Arg. And being asked for tax $. For mongers who do not work here, I would doubt there would be any problems. The problem is you open yourself up to the Arg. Beauracracy, and we DNI pursuers are aware of that morass.
Is it possible they will tax you on your world wide income and Soc. Security.
It worries me they will get too intrusive.
Thoughts.
Jackpot DNI holder.First as an international jewel thief I'm always thinking "under the radar." Ok I'm not an international jewel thief but I do think under the radar. I would pay the price of 5 trips per year to Uruguay but they have good poker there so no big deal.
Other side, I would wonder how they would cross reference your passport upon exiting with your CUIL. In the states with the unpatriotic act in force I could see it but we are talking about Argentina, where you're lucky if the guy in the immigration booth at the airport takes his eyes off the ass of the girl working in the next booth long enough to see if your face matches what's on your passport. That assumes that the guy that is supposed to link your CUIL to your passport number stopped watching the Boca/River classic long enough to punch the numbers in the computer. Which also assumes that the person who was supposed to buy the computer didn't take the mangos appropriated for the computer system and spend them on a mini estancia in Uruguay and a couple working girls from Black. Which further assumes that the taxes needed for the appropriation for the computer system where paid. See what I mean?
I know this post was useless but I didn't attack anybody and hope it is found amusing.
Best advise, talk to a lawyer, but then again that assumes that the guy you talk to is actually a lawyer and not some picatero that got tired of walking in the street, saw an empty office, and put up a sign calling himself a lawyer waiting for some dumb extranjero to walk in and hand him money for useless advise.
If I ever get back I think it will be Uruguay 5 times a year for me, they have nice poker of there you know. Not as loose as at Dirks house of course but the chairs are nicer.
Suerte,
Daddy, missing BsAs sooo fucking bad I can barely stand it.
Hi,
Whats the minimum time someone with a resident visa in Argentina needs to spend in the country to not lose that status (with intention to obtain the permanent resident status after 2-3 years)
Born To Die
05-14-08, 11:11
Well here is the place to ask for advice on the laziest fastest route to obtain a residency of any description in Argentina. Preferably I would just like to pay someone. Does anyone have any advice or responsible agency that would complete this process.
Born To Die / Dead Lazy
This is a good one, but expensive. Around $ 1000- $ 2000 US.
There is another one that is slightly cheaper. I forgot the name of it though.
http://www.argentinaresidency.com/
Regards,
BM.
Thomaso276
05-14-08, 22:43
Regardless of what these places advertise, you are going to do alot of leg work yourself. Read their page carefully, you have to get your Criminal history in the States, birth certificate and any financial docs (all with a Apostille stamp from the USA) You can arrange a meeting with Arg consulate in your area of USA.
Apparently they are going to provide you with a cab from the airport and translation services for the docs. (which can be done in USA as well. As well as act as a travel agency.
Intiate immigration process means going to the office and waiting in line to present your papers.
One thing I noticed all over the Immigration office my last time there were the notices posted telling people they do not need to pay anyone for the process!
Maybe I should go work for them because the system is pretty straight forward and apparently pretty easy if done in the USA through the consulate.
I have been living here for four years, and I have no DNI, no residency, no nothing. And, talking to those people who do have residency, I see no advantage in having it. None whatsoever at all. It just seems to give you the ability to do things you don't want to do anyway, like have an Argentinean bank account. Hello? The banks here are totally crooked so why deal with them?
So for those of you who got residency, I have two questions:
1) How much did it cost? And
2) What the fuck are the advantages?
I just don't understand.
1) How much did it cost? And.
2) What the fuck are the advantages?1) the real cost it's 200 pesos.
2) the adventages are:
- Not getting imprissioned when a police procedure occurs, for example, when in a middle of a riot, and you show your expired visa passport.
- The ability of getting a local driver's license.
- You can SELL property, (depending on the notary public, some will not allow you to SELL property with the CDI only)
- You can show your Argentine DNI to the russian maffia, and they will respect you as a real gangster.
So for those of you who got residency, I have two questions:
1) How much did it cost? And.
2) What the fuck are the advantages?DH,
It cost me $400 ARS when I first applied, and $300 ARS to renew it two years later. Upon the next renewal next year it becomes permanent with no further renewals required.
The advantages to me:
1. I don't have to leave the country every 90 days to renew my visa.
2. I am not in technical violation of Argentina's immigration laws by being here more than 180 days a year.
3. When arriving here at the airport I can breeze through immigration via the Citizens/Residents line instead of waiting behind all the tourists in the Visitors line.
4. I get the Argentina Citizen's price for domestic airline flights.
5. I can legally hold a job, offer services and/or operate a business here.
6. I am no longer dependent on my home country's passport and can in fact legally live here permanently without it.
7. It makes it much more difficult to deport me in the event that I should be involved in some sort of legally objectionable incident.
Thanks,
Jackson
That was the total cost? Including the FBI report and local police report and the translations thereof?
I looked around a lot on that 180 days per year thing and I never was able to verify it, although I found something that said it applied to UK nationals.
9-Toe Moe got an Argie driver's license and he did not have a DNI.
How long do you have to have residency before you can apply for citizenship and a passport? Does the DNI convey Mercosur privileges, meaning the right to go to the other Mercosur countries without using your US passport?
#1 and #7 are the only ones on Jackson's list that would really matter to me. I am getting really sick of that stupid boat ride.
Hi,
You are correct that my previously quoted costs were only the fees paid to the Immigration Dept.
As I recall, the fees for my FBI report and the local arrest record were not significant. Also, I believe that the translation fee was somewhere in the neighborhood of 150 pesos, but that was 4 years ago, so I'm sure it's at least double that now.
Moore would be better able to answer the citizenship / Argentina passport questions as he's been through it.
The Permanent Residency DOES NOT convey Mercosur privileges as I discovered when planning a trip to Rio a few months ago, said privileges being based solely upon one's passport.
Thanks,
Jackson
To be honest I think the only two factors for getting one would be.
1) Not having to take the ferry once every couple of months.
2) Paying local airfares.
Other than that, if you're not planning on living here for many many years, there is no real reason for getting one.
FYI.
*You can get an Argentinian Drivers License without a DNI.
* You can get an International Drivers License and drive anywhere in the world.
* You can buy and sell property without a DNI.
Regards,
BM.
Well, I have been living here for many years and I plan to live here for many more years, probably, maybe or not. Note that an international driver's license is only valid in conjunction with another (valid) driver's license. In fact it is a translation of information contained on the other driver's license. For Americans it is primarily necessary when driving in countries that use other alphabets, like Greece, Bulgaria, Thailand, etc.
0��� (link did not paste correctly)
www.worldtravels.com
Says that US citizens, Australians, Kiwis, and South Africans are allowed unlimited entries of three months (or maybe it says 90 days) It does not say that about UK nationals, Irish, or Canadians. This is consistent with my earlier research. I don't think there is any 180 per year limit for Americans. I could not find anything about it on the Argentinean immigration web site, either. I have been here over 300 days in 2005, 2006, and 2007 and was also here over 180 days in 2004.
I have been here over 300 days in 2005, 2006, and 2007 and was also here over 180 days in 2004.All I can say is: Mira Vos.
Suerte.
Stowe
Born To Die
05-16-08, 13:10
I have good reasons to be an resident did not really want to spark a couch expert opinion poll, but I just wanted a little help so I did not have to get off my ass. Argentina Residency I suggest has lost her other brain cell and has nothing left for the other brain cell to rub against to produce a thought. And just as an aside I still very much love this country.
BTD
Argentina Residency I suggest has lost her other brain cell and has nothing left for the other brain cell to rub against to produce a thought.Hi Born To Die,
What exactly does that mean?
Please advise.
Thanks,
Jackson
0��� (link did not paste correctly)
www.worldtravels.com
Says that US citizens, Australians, Kiwis, and South Africans are allowed unlimited entries of three months (or maybe it says 90 days) It does not say that about UK nationals, Irish, or Canadians. This is consistent with my earlier research. I don't think there is any 180 per year limit for Americans. I could not find anything about it on the Argentinean immigration web site, either. I have been here over 300 days in 2005, 2006, and 2007 and was also here over 180 days in 2004.The entire subject warrants further research.
Personally, I can't find a definitive answer on any Argentine Government website or from any other source. However, many popular sport fucking destinations (Thailand, Brazil) and many countries in Latin America that I have visited do have such a limitation.
Thanks,
Jackson
I researched the living piss out of it twice, once a couple of years ago and once over the last two days. Cannot find any verification anywhere of any such requirement.
Born To Die
05-19-08, 11:34
I guess what I am looking for is someone to do the leg work with knowledge of what is needed to achieve residency. I have a unique case and I need to speak to a knowledgeable person. I have spent a year on this already and with the same credentials as my brother in-law (Mendoza) I have not received residency and he has inside of 2 months.
I guess what I am looking for is someone to do the leg work with knowledge of what is needed to achieve residency. I have a unique case and I need to speak to a knowledgeable person. I have spent a year on this already and with the same credentials as my brother in-law (Mendoza) I have not received residency and he has inside of 2 months.Hire an immigration attorney if you want something close to a definitive answer. The other advantage in doing that is they usually know someone who can smooth the process along.
Argentina generally doesn't hand out residency for no reason. You'll need to bring something to the table - I. E. Buying property, starting a business, retiring, working, etc.
StrayLight
05-20-08, 20:12
So for those of you who got residency, I have two questions:
1) How much did it cost? And.
2) What the fuck are the advantages?
I just don't understand.1) I don't remember the exact costs for the initial visa, but when I renew every year, I need to pay (a) the cost of notarizing appropriate documents in the U. S. (normally just a few bucks) (b) the cost of getting those documents apostilled (normally USD $10 a document) (c) the cost of DHLing the apostilled documents (about USD $25) and (d) $200 pesos at Immigration when I renew.
2) In addition to advantages (real or imagined) that others have mentioned, if you have residency, you can ship your household goods into the country and pay vastly lower customs fees than you would if you didn't have residency. In fact, you don't pay customs fees; you pay a nominal insurance premium to guarantee that you're not going to sell your stuff here. When your residency becomes permanent, you stop paying the premiums.
Hi,
The Cordob AFIP office, told me by phone, that one cannot obtain a QUIT without going thru Migraciones and having some kind of residency. But if I understood correctly, having a DNI is not mandatory (which I don't for lack of perm residence status) I currently have a certificado de domicilio, and a CDI, the latter about which AFIP said is sufficient to purchase property in Argentina.
Can someone clear this up please?
Thanks,
Bodhi.
For a lack of any answer to it, I repost this text, in the hope someone can share relevant info.It's not easy to answer because it depends on the type of visa and where you are from.
Work visas for US and Canadians (and I think Western Europeans) have to be renewed every year. There doesn't seem to be any way around that.
After three years, however you can get a 'permanent' DNI.
Not sure about other types of visas or other nationalities.
Member #3320
08-06-08, 17:35
Please advise if one has to pay any custom duty on importing expensive (above 100,000 USd worth) 2nd hand cars to Argentina from one's home country, once one becomes a permanent resident here.
Thanks
Please advise if one has to pay any custom duty on importing expensive (above 100,000 USd worth) 2nd hand cars to Argentina from one's home country, once one becomes a permanent resident here.
ThanksMinimum will be 50%. And I guess a premium as a luxury item though this is a surmise. Citizenship brings obligations and precious little benefits. Welcome to 'Argentina World'.
Argento
Permanent residency and citizenship are two very different things.
Greetings,
So now that I have my CDI, I can share that the clerk at AFIP, told me that it entails permission to work, although of course she is not the Migraciones.
Please, can anybody clarify this issue? Also, I believe Rock Harders, wrote that he has a Residencia Precaria, but the Tramite from Migraciones, says it is to be given only when one initiates some petition for permanent residence, so in effect is in lieu of a tourist visa, and I recall I think it was even given to me once as Un Extension. Then one needs to leave the country and start the cycle again.
What gives.
Thanks,
Bodhi
Rock Harders
08-07-08, 16:35
Mongers,
Although I thought this had been cleared up ad nauseum, I'll explain things one more time.
First, a CDI is a taxpayer identification number given only to foreigners for the purpose of buying property (real estate, a car, boat, or securities) A CUIL / CUIT is a taxpayer identification number given to residents / citizens of the country and confers the right to work. A CUIL is a personal taxpayer identification number whereas a CUIT is a corporate taxpayer identification number. A person may be assigned a CUIL by ANSES, located on Cordoba / Carlos Pellegrini upon having obtained residencia precaria / residencia temporario. With this temporary CUIL number, a person may open a bank account, and conduct other financial activities.
After a period of 90 days, at least in my case (this is true in all cases UNLESS you are Paraguayan, Bolivian, or Peruvian; they have to wait an indefinite period to get full residency, a DNI, etc. Because they were granted residencia precaria solely for being from these neighboring countries and do not have a work contract, investor visa, etc. The residencia precaria becomes a renewable 1 year residencia temporario, and at that point one is able to make an appointment to apply for a DNI. After a period of two or three months, you will go to your appointment to apply for the DNI. Assuming they accept your DNI application, there will then be a waiting period of anywhere between 90 and 180 days to actually receive the DNI booklet. Once you receive the DNI, you are supposed to go back to ANSES and get your permanent CUIL assigned (which will essentially be your DNI number, with a 20 in front of it along with an 8 attached to the end)
Interestingly enough, I really did not ever need the DNI, because I had the CUIL assigned, and I was able to get power of attorney based off my passport as my primary document, so as such I was able to conduct all the necessary business transactions. So if you control a business here, go to your lawyer, have power of attorney assigned to you, and you can do every single transaction that one would normally need a DNI for (bank transactions, hiring / firing employees, entering contracts, etc) by just using your passport.
Suerte,
Rock Harders
Interestingly enough, I really did not ever need the DNI,Just curious, is your DNI permanent or does it expire? If so, do you have to renew it yearly?
Also, the time frames I experienced with the DNI were exactly as you mentioned.
Today I saw a sign at a taxi stand in V. Lopez saying you needed to show a DNI to rent a fucking taxi. Could be they are bluffing, could be they would accept a different ID, but that's what it said. Kind of scary.
Today I saw a sign at a taxi stand in V. Lopez saying you needed to show a DNI to rent a fucking taxi. Could be they are bluffing, could be they would accept a different ID, but that's what it said. Kind of scary.This is because the taxis get robbed frequently so the drivers tired of it or scared of being robbed only pick up passengers at stands or points where they can be identified. Any identification will do and in most cases not even needed. It depends a lot on if you look suspicious or not.
Yeah, I figured that. Maybe more for the "Racism in Argentina" thread. Major stereotyping going on here.
Greetings,
Finally, I easily obtained my CDI (Clave de Indentidad) from AFIP, my own number, which registered successfully on the AFIP website, following my creating a password. Cost: 0.00.
The clerk at AFIP, and the next day: a higher-up official, via phone call, inormed me that with my CDI, I can be employed in Argentina legally. Sure enough other sites relating to Migraciones say or imply otherwise.
One can "inscribirse". I. E.: sign up as an Independent, as well. Seems the best option, at least for me regarding this registration as Indep. Is:
"Independent Eventual", which means one pays, if any, taxes on contracted work (some employers here may prefer that)
Anway, most everybody except AFIP, had never even heard of a CDI, and I have yet to obtain employment.
Glad to learn from others input.
Thanks,
Samten
Sorry, I did not mention that I haven't a DNI and presently do not qualify to have one, which explains the investigation of employment sans a DNI.
Samten
Yeah, I figured that. Maybe more for the "Racism in Argentina" thread. Major stereotyping going on here.That's not racism, but, classism. The fact of discriminating a lower-class / middle-lower person.
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